that is just my opinion. If I were me I would be looking for the best foundation bitch I could find to start my breeding programme with because its a hell of a long way up if you start at the bottom.

Because three people off this forum emailed me and told me personally that the ears really are not that big of an issue and can be corrected over time. As well as gave me guidance on what to look for.

The fact of the matter is a lot of dogs apparently need assistance with their "ears" Because most puppies I see and "show dog puppies" all have their ears appearing buttoned from the pictures I've seen on the internet and bullynet etc. So just my honest opinion about that. I'm not breeding my older female, she's going on 10 years old. I was just simply showing a picture of her ear set as well. The female I intend on using to start my line off with is the one that has an ear set that is a little too erect. Now, they do rose, but they are a bit tulip. If you haven't seen my female in person you cannot truly judge her. Simple as that. We all know how it's hard to judge a dog in pictures and how the dog can appear in person is completely different.

very nice

if I could change them I would like them a tad thinner

button ears and tulip ears which your girls have ruin the entire expression of the dog. I would not breed from either girl but that is just my opinion and I do not mean to offend you at all.

Mike and the bullies

And I'm a little sad this happened with my starting bitch. But everyone learns sometime and without seeing these faults and breeding for better, we would never improve or learn to begin with. It's not like I have all my dogs and they all have "faults" in their ears. I'm working towards better and a future of better by learning from everything at the foundation.

By the way, the staple thing. I did a youtube video on gluing ears and that was a video of a spanish breeder stapling a pups ears. I guess that's a practice some are doing as well obviously.

I appreciate everyone's opinions and info. Thanks.

Heavens. No way should a staple EVER be used!!

At one time even glueing would be considered "faking"..

Light glue is fine...Like the Duo eyelash adhesive. Construction adhesive, cow tag glue, staples, earrings... If this is your normal routine with every litter, time to start re-thinking things...

I like these ears.. Nice and SMALL.

Surprises me sometimes what some people feel are acceptable.

A few things about that video;

put the glue on sparingly and let the air hit it for a few seconds before you set them. The glue is tackier then and you won't have pop-ups.

Also watch the way you set them. Glued ears often develop the same "flat" tell-tale shape.

That a dog should be excluded from a breeding program for faulty ears. But, a bitch should be close to the standard. No dog is perfect, that is very true. But, I believe only a selcect few should be bred. To me the idea is to better the breed by breeding good quality dogs. Sure, some faults can be controlled by carefully selected breedings but, if the dog has many faults, what's the point. Also, one has to know how to pick a stud to compliment their bitch and one that will hopefully correct the faults of the bitch. That's not a simple process.

I take breeding dogs very seriously, that's why I have never done it. I felt like I had too much to learn about bulldogs, the standard, and exhibiting dogs before I gave breeding a try.

I would advise anyone who is considering breeding to read and make sure they understand the standard. I would also advise them to join a bulldog club or if one is not available, an all breed club.

My bitch has strengths in other areas that can outweigh the ears with the right male. Pictures don't always do justice to a dog or show its true colors like an in person observation.

Just because my girl doesn't have "ideal" ears, doesn't mean she would'nt be an asset to breeding. See I think that's why so many people wind up with problems when breeding, not many have the "PERFECT" dog in every area, if at all. So, I see that logic as being flawed.

So the pic above is my first 2 bulldogs. The one on the bottom was bought as a pet and she had ears closer to what your girl has (she's relaxed in this photo so they don't look so bad). She was a pet overall, loads of things about her that I wouldn't want to duplicate. The girl on top was a much nicer representation of the breed and has much better ears.

Here is a better photo of the older girl and her ears.



Shelley - Sophie N Angels Mocha & Stella

Hi Nick,
I'm not sure how to put this. Depending on how well you know the breeders with whom you've spoken will depend on the answers they give you about the ears. I don't think ears are a make or break deal when breeding a dog it's the overall balance of the dog and health. I do know from speaking with a friend who has been trying to fix heavy ear leather in her line, it hasn't been an easy fix.



Shelley - Sophie N Angels Mocha & Stella

It's good for puppies if you know how to use it.

However, I don't think a bitch should be bred that is not a good representation of the breed. Otherwise, what do you hope to gain by the breeding?

I never would, but I saw a youtube video of a breeder doing this very such thing. I don't even think some people would think gluing the ears is right either though.

"That's not ideal to use a staple gun is it?"

YOURSELF?!! Using a staple gun to get her ears in place would just be plain cruelty!

Yup. That's why I just took it upon myself to ask everyone here. I have a good idea of a Stud, but even if the stud is a Champion it doesn't mean he is ideal, so I want to find him well in advanced before I need him. I'm starting from scratch and want to get a good start. I am a little upset at myself about the Gluing of her ears, I should have done that. Another thing I saw online was someone using a staple? That's not ideal to use a staple gun is it?

I'll defer to a couple of others who have already posted, but it is very likely gluing her ears now will have no beneficial effects. When puppies are young, the cartilage of the ear is very soft and muscles are still growing and can be trained to a degree (the process of gluing keeps the ear in place and helps the muscle that holds the ear back). This is why it's done early. At her age, the cartilage has hardened and muscles have matured. Honestly, I don't think it's worth doing now. I really just offered the video link so you could see what the process is all about, not to suggest that you should try doing it now.

others think, its black and white in the standard. People try and add shades of gray.

Vicky,
Bosco, Bella, Breve' & Holly

www.LangagerBulldogs.com

PHOTOS ARE PROPERTY OF LANGAGER BULLDOGS, YOU MUST HAVE WRITTEN PERMISSION FOR ANY USE OF THESE PHOTOS FROM LANGAGERBULLDOG.

But the thing is every breeder says something different. One breeder may like their dogs to have a little more of a sway back, while others will not. Everyone has an opinion and that's the main issue at hand. I've been told several different things by a few different people. I still have a lot to learn, no doubt, but it's frustrating when 3 different breeders say 3 different things. So that's the issue at hand.

First I hope you have read the standard. I have provided a link to the whole standard on the AKC site as well as the BCA Illustrated guide.

http://www.akc.org/breeds/bulldog/
http://thebca.org/illustrated1.pdf


If you are ever planning on breeding you should have read this standard many, many times to be able to evaluate whether you should be breeding your bitch. Just becasue they are purebred and AKC registered doesn't mean the should have puppies.


Here is what the standard says about ears (if you have not).

Ears--The ears should be set high in the head, the front inner edge of each ear joining the outline of the skull at the top back corner of skull, so as to place them as wide apart, and as high, and as far from the eyes as possible. In size they should be small and thin. The shape termed "rose ear" is the most desirable. The rose ear folds inward at its back lower edge, the upper front edge curving over, outward and backward, showing part of the inside of the burr. (The ears should not be carried erect or prick-eared or buttoned and should never be cropped.)

The bitch that Elizabeth showed you has a beautiful head piece and ears. The ears should rose without gluing.

What you will see now is ears that are too big, heavy leathers and many don't rose well because they are too heavy.

Her ears do look rosed a lot as well, but I guess when they are in that position and from the front view they aren't looked at as "Ideal"... Her ears were never glued, I wasn't sure she needed it, and now I see how it should be done. And after a week and the glue dries off? Do you re apply glue for a good while so the ears set nice?

but I have had puppies that had to have their ears glued a couple times before they would stay back.

This is Spanky at about 12-14 weeks (his ears look glued, but they aren't)



Here he is at about 6 months



This Spanky at about 10 months



Here he is now



Michelle, Helen, Penny, Spanky and Faye pup

This youtube video was something I found some time ago when I was asking similar questions. It'll give you an idea of what's done, how it's done, and the before and after look.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3TglVETpW0

This dog's ears are a bit big, and the angle his head is at has his left ear falling a bit forward. But his right ear illustrates how the ears should be flat off the top of the head.


This bitch's ears are nicely rosed, decent sized and held well.


Please don't view these as absolute 'wonderful examples' - they are not. But hopefully others will post more photos and that will give you a better idea of correct placement, shape and size of Bulldog ears.

Here is a link to the BCA Illustrated Standard. Pages 5 & 6 have drawings and text to help explain the Bulldog ear.
http://thebca.org/illustrated1.pdf

Can you see the ears and what they will be like? How long and when do you determine if the ears are "okay enough" to keep and breed with that dog?

I want to breed up obviously to a better male for better offspring. I understand now, thanks for clearing that up. And no I never glued my first female's ears as I wasn't into the idea of showing or caring about type to that degree. I got into all of the rest at a later time, when she was around 4-5 years old. I never bred my first female either. Anymore good ideas of good ears on bulldogs, post as many pictures as possible. Thanks for responses.

It is to late to glue the young girls ears. And yes, unforunately they are high. Was her ears glued as a puppy?

Your older bitch has what alot of people call "button" ears, those should have been glued when a pup. Those don't have any "rose" to them. If you check on the bca website for ears, it gives you what they should look like also.

the ears on both dogs are poor, and they are what they are (meaning you won't be able to fix them now), but the fly ear one will continue to improve a bit with age as her head grows, the set won't be as offensive as her head widens. They will never be perfect. You are not only fighting set, you are fighting shape and size too. If yor plan is breeding for improvement, you can get it done, but it takes dilligence and a few generations.

Bulldog ears are small and rosed. You should not have to glue them as babies, or if you do, it should take one light glue (eyelash adhesive) and they should be set in a day or two. Any super duty adhesive, cow tag glue, all that over the top type stuff just means ears are a problem for that breeder or breeders. Ears on American dogs are known world wide for being awful in general. The amount of product I hear being discussed as adhesive just proves that.

Breed to good ears (and obvioulsy a dog that has excellent type too, in addition to perfect ears). Do not keep and breed any puppy with the same ears as mom. If you keep getting ears like mom, regardless of the dogs you breed her too, start over. This is if you want to have good dogs.

Here are good ears, I wish they were a hair smaller. They should always be rosed, even when they are alert.

She's too old for that in my opinion. If her ears were not glued as a pup, they should have been. Just curious but what did you mean by "breeding up".

Here is my other female and her "Ears"

[IMG][/IMG]

Here she is at 10 weeks old and then 10 months old. The 10 month old one may be at a bad angle, but you get the idea. Just trying to get to the bottom of this. Also can any of you guys post some pictures of "ideal" ears. My other female who's 9 yrs old has different ears as well, if I'm getting the idea right, I'd want a combination of both Sasha's and Mya's ears in one? Right? Or a combination of her "pup ears" and her "now ears"? If that makes sense. Thanks.


[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

They can be glued, or use massage. I kinda form a pups ears, and press them down like you want them to look. I was told about this. I don't know how it works as I'm just now trying it. One year is a little old I hear to form ears, but also hear it can be done.

Steve